Refracta Development, Scripts, etc.
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golinux

- golinux
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## Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Mon Sep 29, 2014 4:17 am

I noticed in another thread that systemd seemed to be creating a problem for refractasnapshot/installer. Are you running across enough glitches to try to get it out of refracta? Or is refracta just going to go with the flow and take whatever DebHat is going to push through? Curious minds would like to know.
fsmithred

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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Mon Sep 29, 2014 5:49 pm

You have good timing. I just uploaded a non-systemd, no X11 jessie to the testing folder.
http://distro.ibiblio.org/refracta/file ... 9_1256.iso
I expect to get the tools to work with systemd, because I want them to work with stock debian and debian derivatives. I think the problem you're thinking of has to do with autologin. It'll either work out or not - it's not terribly important.
Meanwhile, I'm playing around with jessie-sysv. The installation now has openbox, lxterminal, xfe (file manager), xpdf, xarchiver, all the comman-line diagnostic/rescue/repair apps that have been in the last few versions of refracta, and not much more than that. I'll play around some more, and then maybe make another snapshot. The nox version is so I can start over easily with a base system until a decision is made about what desktop to use.
So, I don't really have an answer about whether the next version of refracta will use systemd or sysvinit. I'd like to stick as close to pure debian as possible, but I have some doubts about systemd. I sure wasn't happy when it wouldn't boot after replacing one of the (non-system) hard drives. Got an error from fsck that the volume needed to be checked but wasn't available. So I put the old hard drive back in, let fsck run, changed the max count so it woudn't want to run again, put the new hard drive in, and still couldn't boot. That's when I remembered there was an entry for one partition in fstab. Had to reboot into recovery mode to fix it, and then reboot again. If the system had asked me in the first place if I wanted to drop to recovery mode, it would have saved me a few reboots.
fsmithred

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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:57 pm

Didn't mention this in the last post, but I used Dean's post over at duf to exclude anything systemd by pinning "*systemd*" to "-1". Can't install refractasnapshot-gui or refractainstaller-gui, because they depend on gksu, which depends on dbus, which depends on libsystemd-journal0 and libsystemd-login0. However, if I just copy the scripts into place without installing from the .deb package, they run fine. Just have to start them from a root terminal.
nadir

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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:24 pm

Thanks for the iso, am downloading.
I am in the middle of backing up data to install new distros on all my PC's, and most give me problems (backing them up *again*, cause kFreeBSD doesn't speek cryptsetup or ext4. That is one part of the "problems". Gentoo? Don't ask ... Slackware? No, thanks. BSD? Last solution).
The refracta iso will be of help.
I tried the pinning given by Dean in that thread, but it didn't seem to work on a system where those libsystemd stuff is already installed (really weird and hard to explain things happened in regard with systemd. The reason i did it. It sure *is* odd).
Besides i haven't found a solution for wireless yet (wicd, that is). I could go for wired only, of course.
fsmithred

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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Sep 30, 2014 2:29 am

I started with a wheezy netinstall of standard system. Pinned "*systemd*", excluded Recommends, set jessie as the default release, changed sources to jessie, then update and dist-upgrade and reboot. (Newer kernel got installed in the dist-upgrade.)
Using "aptitude -s install blah..." a lot here to see what will install without any systemd. Lotta stuff gonna be missing in this one.
golinux

- golinux
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:37 am

I figured you'd be on this. Yes, it was the discussion of the autologin problem that prompted me to start this thread. I'm gonna sit back and wait until this sorts out - I'll be on squeeze and wheezy for years to come. By then, hopefully there will be viable alternatives to systemd. Problem is I'll need X11 and media apps which might not be doable on Linux without systemd. I am so pissed that this is happening . . .
nadir

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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Sep 30, 2014 9:54 am

[quote="fsmithred"]I started with a wheezy netinstall of standard system. Pinned "*systemd*", excluded Recommends, set jessie as the default release, changed sources to jessie, then update and dist-upgrade and reboot. (Newer kernel got installed in the dist-upgrade.)
Yeah, like that. Lots of fiddling (way too much, for my taste), and as a result i get

> Lotta stuff gonna be missing in this one

Gotta use my feet, and i will (am in the middle of it, like said, kfreeBSD for now, bit of Gentoo, if both doesn't make me happy, it has to be BSD. Urgh).
Heard that many new (ex Linux) users are to be found in BSD forums. Might be a myth. I hope it is true. That will teach them (that, and only that). Debian IRC channels are dead silent, but it might be like that for longer (didn't use them in a while).
Winter is coming. I am not much in computing anymore, but perhaps i will test the refracta stuff on kFreeBSD (perhaps it doesn't make any sense, i didn't think about it yet). At least that would be good (i am really angry. I learned all that ****, and now i got to go due to such a crap).
Someone somewhere:
"Linux looks more and more like the problem which made us create Linux" Or similar.
fsmithred

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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:05 pm

Check to see if live-boot, et. al. are in the kFreeBSD repo. If so, then maybe the tools can work (with some tweaking.)
I'll be testing different desktops and software combinations with the jessie-sysv installation, reinstalling with the nox iso when I need a clean slate.
Other test I'm doing right now is gentoo stage3 install inside vbox. I wish they still had a live-CD install like the one I tried in 2006 that installed to hard drive in 20 minutes (plus 20 minutes of reading). Maybe next year I'll be working on refractoo.
anticapitalista

- anticapitalista
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Sep 30, 2014 6:43 pm

The problem is not so much creating a live Jessie systemd-free iso, but keeping it that way.
eg Just as a test, I downloaded the iso mentioned above, running live in VirtualBox installed
xorg, jwm. Fine, no issues. Then I tried to install xfce4, but it fails due to unmet dependencies (dbus no doubt - since dbus will bring in systemd).
Keeping Debian Jessie systemd-free is not easy, in fact it is almost impossible, unfortunately.
Last edited by anticapitalista on Tue Sep 30, 2014 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
nadir

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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Sep 30, 2014 7:13 pm

Yeah, xfce4 won't work (i was told in debian IRC to use xfce4 .... go figure).
Gentoo. Whew, that's a tough one (i had to compile the kernel like 5 times before i could do anything ... Now i fail with USE flags ... ).
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