Refracta Development, Scripts, etc.
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nadir

- nadir
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:28 pm

side question towards dzz and fsmithred:
What do the both of you think of going Gnu/kFreeBSD ?
Does it make sense?
Regarding the whole systemd problem only, not in general.
make sense in the meaning of: being way less work. no need to fight against the decisions made all the time.
dzz

- dzz
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Oct 28, 2014 1:42 am

I won't willingly switch to bsd (or anywhere else) as a "refugee" because I'm too lazy to fight my corner. If I find I like it and it works for me that's another matter.
I have a bsd install already. The amount of work to just learn it (at the moment but that might change) is greater than to abandon "Debian purity" and rebuild a small number of packages from source.
The "linux apocalypse" hasn't happened yet. Just made an eudev deb.. more later.
BTW I can't get a live image to boot with the latest util-linux (does in an installation), can anyone else verify that?
nadir

- nadir
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Oct 28, 2014 2:00 am

Weird that pretty much anyone considers Debian Gnu/kFreeBSD to be mainly a BSD system, while i consider it mainly to be Debian (and then a Gnu system, and i pretty much never think of it as a BSD system).
But anyway: thanks for the answer.
eudev you say? Glad to hear it.
fsmithred

- fsmithred
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Oct 28, 2014 5:00 am

I haven't tried any bsd other than a few minutes with a dragonfly live CD several years ago. To have most or all of the debian repo available with bsd certainly seems like a good idea. The large number of packages in debian is one of the main reasons I started using it. But I don't know what I'm going to do.
dzz, I just upgraded my sid now to get the latest util linux, and then I installed the latest installer and snapshot debs, and I got this message. Don't know if it's related to your problem or not. I'm going to make a snapshot and try it. This one is systemd. Right now, I don't have an installation other than this one that will take the latest util-linux.

Code:
  `sid-systemd::/home/user# dpkg -i *.deb
  dpkg: warning: downgrading bsdutils from 1:2.25.2-2 to 1:2.25.1-3
  (Reading database ... 105384 files and directories currently installed.)
  Preparing to unpack bsdutils_1%3a2.25.1-3_i386.deb ...
  Unpacking bsdutils (1:2.25.1-3) over (1:2.25.2-2) ...
  Preparing to unpack refractainstaller-base_9.1.2_all.deb ...
  Unpacking refractainstaller-base (9.1.2) over (9.1.0) ...
  Preparing to unpack refractainstaller-gui_9.1.2_all.deb ...
  Unpacking refractainstaller-gui (9.1.2) over (9.1.0) ...
  Setting up bsdutils (1:2.25.1-3) ...
  Setting up refractainstaller-base (9.1.2) ...
  Configuration file 'F/Fetc/refractainstaller.conf'
  ==> Modified (by you or by a script) since installation.
  ==> Package distributor has shipped an updated version.
  What would you like to do about it ? Your options are:
  Y or I : install the package maintainer's version
  N or O : keep your currently-installed version
  D : show the differences between the versions
  Z : start a shell to examine the situation
  The default action is to keep your current version.
  *** refractainstaller.conf (Y/I/N/O/D/Z) [default=N] ? y
  `

The dist-upgrade a few minutes before that gave me

Code:
  `bsdutils:i386 (2.25.1-5, 2.25.2-2)`

nadir

- nadir
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Oct 28, 2014 3:40 pm

debian kFreeBSD will not only offer the repos, but also the commands known from debian Linux (including the arguments of commands, which can be quite a pain if using BSD, which, obviously, doesn't use GNU). A few are still different, of course.
I mean: there is a reason they call it userland. It is, what the user sees. The kernel? **** knows what it does. Can't recall i ever had to communicate with the kernel (besides modprobe ... ).
I am not proposing that, btw. Just wondering why all kind of people, not only the two of you, don't use a solution already existent (which offers the comfort to not have to relearn all kind of stuff).
fsmithred

- fsmithred
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:58 pm

I made a snapshot from a sid installation that boots with either systemd or sysvinit. The snapshot only boots with systemd. If I add 'init=/lib/sysvinit/init' it hangs about three lines after "Decompressing Linux..."
Using util-linux-2.25.2-2
thwak

- thwak
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Wed Oct 29, 2014 1:46 am

> nadir wrote:side question towards dzz and fsmithred:
> What do the both of you think of going Gnu/kFreeBSD ?
> Does it make sense?

Geez, nadir, are you still mad at me for borrowing your doll babies and losing one of 'em?

> debian-devel-announce-AT-lists.debian.org
> Subject: Bits from the Release Team: transitions, architectures, freeze!
> Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2014
> From: Adam D. Barratt <adam <at> adam-barratt.org.uk>
> Subject: Bits from the Release Team: transitions, architectures, freeze!
> . . . snip . . .
> The following architectures have not made sufficient progress and will not be release architectures for Jessie:
> * hurd-i386
> * sparc
> . . . snip . . .
> kFreeBSD
> ========
> We remain gravely concerned about the viability of this port. Despite the reduced scope, we feel that the port is not currently of sufficient
> quality to feature as a fully supported release architecture in Jessie. However, we accept that our published view of the port has not been
> as 'clear and unambiguous' as we would wish.
> We therefore advise the kFreeBSD porters that the port is in danger of being dropped from Jessie, and invite any porters who are able to
> commit to working on the port in the long term to make themselves known *now*. The factor that gives us greatest concern is the human
> resources available to the port.
> Porters of any architecture need to bear in mind that being part of a stable release is a long commitment to both taking care of stable and
> oldstable, and continuing development in sid. It has implications for the security team, release team, DSA and other parties.
> The urgency of this matter cannot be over-stated. We will assess the viability of kFreeBSD in Jessie on or after 1st November, and a yes/no
> decision will be taken at that time. This will not be a full architecture qualification, but a simple decision on whether or not the
> release team's concerns have been adequately addressed.

nadir

- nadir
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Wed Oct 29, 2014 4:11 am

> thwak wrote:

> > nadir wrote:side question towards dzz and fsmithred:
> > What do the both of you think of going Gnu/kFreeBSD ?
> > Does it make sense?

> Geez, nadir, are you still mad at me for borrowing your doll babies and losing one of 'em?

I don't understand what you mean, nor know who you are.
Should i know you (by another nick) ? Or know of any dolls (an incident) ?
If kFreeBSD is an official release or not doesn't bother me. I also think it shouldn't bother other people too much (depends what they want, of course). If i had the skills i would even use the Hurd.
fsmithred

- fsmithred
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Sun Nov 23, 2014 2:50 pm

> dzz wrote:The debs I built are at the url posted earlier but nothing is tested properly yet. The rebuilt bsdutils seem OK in my installations but a live image boot hangs at "installing knfsd". I don't yet know why or if it is anthing to do with the rebuilt package or some other bug.

I'm getting this now. The snapshot I made on Oct. 27 boots fine, but the ones I've made in the past few days hang on boot at "installing knfsd". I'm still using wheezy versions of dbus and libpulse0, and older jessie version of util linux.
Turning off nfs-common didn't help. Update/dist-upgrade didn't help. Next thing in /var/log/messages after that message on a successful boot (of the installed system) is about ipv6 and eth0, so I tried disabling ipv6. Still squashing, so I haven't gotten to test it yet. Searching for that message about knfsd didn't help either, except to bring me back to this thread.
I did make some recent snapshots of a minimal jessie system that has systemd, and those booted.
fsmithred

- fsmithred
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## Re: Going with the systemd flow . . . or not?

Sun Nov 23, 2014 11:27 pm

In stages, I allowed libsystemd0 and upgraded bsdutils, dbus and libpulse0. Didn't help. Then I tried installing nfs-kernel-server, which provides knfs. Didn't help. There's a bunch of references to nfs in /lib/live/boot/9990-* scripts, but I haven't looked at them yet. I guess I need to go full tilt on this installation and switch it from sysvinit to systemd, to see if that changes things. (Don't want to say "fixes it".) I'm kinda leaning toward the live-boot scripts, but maybe that's more hoping. Changelog shows Oct. 25 as last upgrade, but nothing looks related. Same for the other live-* packages.
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